PHOENIX — There's no sugarcoating it. Things are bad in "The Zone."
It's Phoenix's largest homeless encampment, just blocks away from the State Capitol. In a count this week, there were more than 800 people camping out on the streets in triple-digit temps.
And recently, after obtaining new court records, the 12News I-Team started digging into reports of organized crime in the encampment, including allegations of drug deals and people being forced to pay to camp on city streets.
On Friday, Phoenix Police Commander Brian Freudenthal sat down with the I-Team's Erica Stapleton and photojournalist Roberto Duarte to explain their approach to growing concerns over the encampment. He's spent nearly three decades with the Phoenix Police Department and worked in the area that includes "The Zone" for most of his career, most recently as the commander of the Downtown Operations Unit.
Erica Stapleton: What are police investigating in that area when it comes to organized crime?
Brian Freudenthal: So, within the area around the Human Services campus, we have a very high population of individuals that either have a serious substance use disorder or have a serious mental illness. And that creates an environment that attracts people to want to prey on those individuals that are at the lowest point in their lives.
So there's a certain element out there that would like to prey on them and take advantage of those individuals. So as it relates to organized crime, we do have individuals that specifically go down to the area around the Human Services campus to prey on those individuals. We also have an issue around the campus related to those that get released from prison.
So they spend time in prison, they live the life of a prisoner, which regularly turns into some sort of gang affiliation or association while you're in prison. When they get released and they have nowhere else to go and they have no shelter, no home they go to and they end up in the Human Services Campus, they continue to live the lifestyle that they lived in prison. And that lifestyle leads to preying on those individuals that are in that state of substance use mental illness, and they prey on them. And they do sometimes organize with each other out there to help each other prey on those individuals.
ES: How are people being taken advantage of?
BF: I've worked I've been a police officer for almost 28 years. I worked through the crack epidemic, I worked through the meth epidemic. I've never seen anything like this -– the opioid epidemic is a whole other level. They're preying on those individuals. So whether it's selling, they can get their hands on blues, that are there fentanyl pills for very cheap, and then they can go down there and sell them for very cheap but still make quite a bit of money because of the high addiction rate there is to them and the need to constantly be introducing that into your body into your system. So these individuals that are around the campus are at a level of their substance use disorder that's higher than most other places...so they're able to make money off of those individuals, because the opioids are so cheap, and they're able to sell them even though they're able to sell them cheaper within the area around the campus, they're still able to make quite a bit of money.
ES: You know this is going on. Why can't police stop it?
BF: It's an outdoor area that a drug deal is going on, right? And we're bound by the Fourth Amendment, we're bound by the Constitution just like everybody else. When we go in there in a marked police unit, officers in uniform, those actions aren't being done in front of us. A lot of the information we get is hearsay information that people are telling us because we have really good relationships. Our officers that work down there on a regular basis, they're out there every day for full 10-hour shift. They're talking with these individuals, they're trying to connect them to services at times, they have really good relationships with them. So they're not afraid to tell us but at the same time, they don't want to go on record. They don't want to testify in court. They don't want to prosecute, so we have to do our best to find other ways. Some of those ways are through investigative work by detectives outside of the shelter, officers that can come down there and assist us with those investigations, which we have done recently. We've done them in the past. We do them every so often. And it involves undercover work that goes on down there. We also supplement through technology. We add cameras and try to identify those individuals that are preying through the camera video footage because when we're there, most of those individuals will go into a tent. They won't be visible they won't be committing the crimes obviously in front of a police officer. But we are doing everything we can. It goes back to the issue of having a cooperative victim, a cooperative witness, that's willing to go follow through with prosecution.
ES: I know we're talking about drugs. But we've also heard from talking with people down there, that there is extortion going on. People are saying they've been asked to pay money or else we could face violence, arson, any sort of consequences for not paying people to stay on this city-owned sidewalk and street. How are you dealing with that?
BF: This goes back to the same thing. We have also identified that . We have talked those individuals. We've talked to people out there that have told us that exact story. And we've documented it, we've investigated it. It goes back to again, we can't follow through in the prosecution, we can't testify to what somebody else is telling us. Hearsay is not allowed into a court. We can't utilize that as evidence against an individual. Unless that victim, unless that witness wants to come forward and testify and actually go through that whole process. Our hands have been pretty much tied related to that enforcing that kind of crime. However, we're using every tool we can to investigate it.
ES: And just to confirm you have not received any actual reports of people being extorted to stay out there?
BF: We have documentation. We have interviewed people and we've documented that have said it's going on. But they didn't say they were the victim of it. So it goes under hearsay. Under the Crime Suppression Plan, I know this is a newer thing, but there are now cameras down there.
ES: How do officers approach patrolling? Is it more of someone has to call for help and you respond? Or is there a patrol element to this neighborhood where they could maybe just see this happening and take action?
BF: Yeah, it's a combination. It's a combination of us responding to radio calls responding when somebody calls 911 or calls Crime Stop. We're going to respond. That's what those officers that are assigned to the Human Services Campus do.
We are also out there visible patrol, active patrol. I'm sure you saw some of our statistics where we've made numerous arrests, we've written numerous citations, we've made numerous field interrogation contacts. And that's just officers being active, being proactive, and trying to identify the criminal activity that's going on. As it relates to the cameras, we did put cameras on there. But we've had cameras down there for a while now. The Human Services Campus, we work very closely with them. One of their stipulations to add the additional 100 beds was to increase their security staff along with cameras. And they were able to put some cameras down there that we have access to. We work really closely with the Human Services Campus and their security team. And we utilize the access to their cameras along with our cameras to supplement them.
ES: How has that footage been helpful?
BF: It's been very helpful. There have been, and again, it's not just our video cameras, but there's the video camera that we utilize from the Human Services Campus have been very useful in prosecution of cases. The cameras from some of the business owners that have supplied their footage to us have also been very helpful in prosecution.
ES: Are there gangs in the zone?
BF: We don't have documentation of a specific gang that's running the zone, or the area around the Human Services Campus. We run into gang members or gang associates on a regular basis down there. We don't see them all on one group. But we do have a lot of individuals that have gang affiliation that are in the area around the campus.
ES: But it's hard to discern if they're on their own?
BF: Right. As individuals get released from prison, as we talked about earlier, and they go down there, you're getting individuals from multiple different gangs that are now getting released from prison and now they're going to the area around the Human Services Campus. So, we've already have documentation of them being affiliated or being a member of a gang. We're running into individuals like that in the area around the campus, but we aren't seeing them all gang getting together to form one solid gang.
ES: And when it comes to drugs, extortion, these stories that you hear happening, are they typically people that are also unsheltered that are doing this? Or are they people that are going to that area, specifically taking advantage and then leaving?
BF: It's a combination of both. Some of our investigations, especially as it relates to the sale of drugs, is they're obviously being brought in from outsiders, right? And they're preying on these individuals coming in from the outside. So we definitely have people coming in from the outside that have committed crimes in the area around the campus. But it's also being committed by individuals that are unsheltered also.
ES: Why might people not want to talk about what happened to them?
BF: It goes back to serious mental illness, it goes back to substance use disorders, and - it comes down to fear to some are fearful of retaliation. We are down there as much as we can, but they know we can't be down there 24/7. We can't protect them 24/7. And they're fearful that they're going to get retaliated and we'll offer them the services. And we'll also offer them shelter and an opportunity to leave the area around the campus. But when when they're dealing with with a serious substance use disorder or serious mental illness, it's hard for them to leave.
ES: So, you know people are in this bad environment, these things are happening. You know what's happening, but you can't see it always happening. How do you help people?
BF: We do our best to be there and just try to be present and be as active as we can to find other ways and alternative ways to prosecute these individuals that we know are committing these types of crimes. And we do that through undercover work, through the video cameras and trying to be active. We do make a lot of arrests down there. But we do also have a lot of individuals that have the potential of committing a serious crime at any moment. So it's not the same as a typical crime issue that you get into a neighborhood or an apartment complex, you have a lot of individuals that again, have a serious substance use disorder, a serious mental illness, and then you have predators.
ES: You're doing your best to help people but there are still crimes happening. Is that a barrier for people ending their homelessness? If they're just continually being victimized, is that a barrier?
BF: I don't see that as a barrier. What I will say is we work very closely with the Office of Homeless Solutions. I've been working in the area around the campus my entire career and we have never had the cooperation that we have right now, with the Office of Homeless Solutions, with Community Bridges, with all of our partners, the Human Services Campus. The cooperation we have, that we're working together with, because everybody sees it, right? People that work down there, and they're not blind, they see this. And we're doing everything we can to offer these individuals shelter to get them off the streets. I think personally, that the biggest barriers are the substance use disorder or the mental illness for these individuals making the correct decision to get off the streets, obtain the shelter that's offered to them. Some of them just don't want to leave that environment and leaves that access to they currently have down there.
ES: Why keep working in this area?
BF: It is something that I believe in. The work that's getting done down there. That I believe in the work that we can do down there. I do feel that this is the most difficult time of my entire career of working there around the campus. This has been the most difficult time to truly understand how we can impact it. In the past, we've utilized other alternatives and enforcement has always been a tool for us in "The Zone" related to some of the current statutes that we aren't enforcing that had been set forth by both Boise and the judge as it relates to the tents in the structures down there. And we have in the past been able to utilize that as a tool. We're definitely not the answer to the to ending homelessness, not even close, but we've used that in the past, and we've we've lost that tool, and now we're trying to find a way to come up with other options and other ways to address these issues.
ES: In your opinion, what is the answer?
BF: In my opinion, it's going to take a serious effort to address the substance use disorder, it's going to take a serious effort to, to, to attack the mental illness, it's down there. And it's going to take a serious effort to locate and identify appropriate shelter, and in homes and housing for these individuals. All three of them make I don't believe it's just one solution. I believe it's all three of them are and it's even more than that. Right. But I believe that is the answer. I don't think the police are the answer. But I do think that we can help. And that's our goal is to be a part of the solution, and worked closely with all the other organizations to come up with the solution. But we're not the answer.
ES: Do you think your officers in that area face more challenges than if they were working in other parts of the city?
BF: I don't want to minimize it at all. There's a huge concentration as in the area around the campus. But this is not a problem specific to the campus. This is a problem that is a citywide problem. This is something that officers are facing no matter where they work in this in the city, no matter where you work on this police department. Trying to come up with solutions to ending, to helping unsheltered people or trying to address the criminal activity related to the unsheltered - every officer on this police department faces it. Every officer in this valley.
ES: Does Phoenix police have to treat "The Zone" differently than other areas?
BF: No.
ES: Even when there are cameras? How often are you employing undercover work, cameras? The gunfire detectors? Is that unique to "The Zone"?
BF: No. I would have undercover officers down there all the time, right? I'm able to get them down there and utilize undercover and other other means of investigative work. When it's our turn, that gets moved around the city. We are utilizing those same techniques in other areas of the city. So, if it was something that was unique to the area around the campus, then I would have them down there 24/7 365 days a year.
ES: What more do you need from the city for you and your officers to better do your jobs and handle what's been going on in "The Zone?"
BF: I don't know if it's what I need from the city. I think it's what we need from the courts. Because there are two separate courts that we're dealing with right now. I think we need clear direction, one clear direction. We need one clear direction on what we can and can't do as it relates to enforcement in the area around the campus. I think will help relieve some of the confusion that I think officers currently face when they're doing enforcement around the campus.
But as it relates to the city? I truly believe that the city is going in the right direction. They're continuing to try to hire and trying to build that Office of Homeless Solutions. Solutions aren't going to happen overnight. Nobody has figured out, solved the issue of the shelter or homelessness. And I truly believe that we're heading in the right direction now.
ES: To that some people would say it's too little too late. How do you respond to that?
BF: I wouldn't say it's too little. Is it late? I think we're late to the game. I agree. However, there were a lot of hurdles that we had to get over. I think that some of the impacts of COVID-19 truly impacted our response. And you can really see a direct correlation to that timeframe. And this can also see the correlation to the Martin v. Boise case, right? There was definitely a correlation to COVID and the response and the buildup of individuals down there during that time. So when we say too late, I don't think we're too far past COVID to be truly addressing the issues that were created during that timeframe.
ES: How could you have responded differently to maybe not be behind the ball?
BF: I wasn't down there in COVID, during that timeframe. That was one of the times that I was in another area of responsibility so I don't know exactly how that all went down. I don't really know if I can give an answer to that.
ES: It's been detailed that there are higher rates of crime in The Zone in the area of the Human Services Campus? How does that impact the rest of the city?
BF: My entire career working down there, it's always been one of the areas with a higher crime rate. That's not new. It definitely is higher than it was in previous years for sure. It definitely impacts the businesses and the residents around the area of the campus. But as far as it relates to the rest of the city, I'm not sure I have a good understanding or grasp of how it impacts the rest of the city.
ES: Does responding to "The Zone" take away from other coverage that you would otherwise have in other parts of the city?
BF: We utilize this squad, the number of officers that we dedicate to the area around the campus has always been that way. For as long as I've been around, we've always dedicated officers specifically to that area around the campus. So, I don't believe it truly pulls away from other resources because historically we've always done that. When we add officers on overtime to assist with crime suppression projects, that's pretty typical and other areas that have high crime rates. We utilize officers on overtime to try to address some of the issues in those areas. So I don't think it has that drastic of an impact on the rest of the city or resources.
ES: How did things get so bad?
BF: I wish I had the answer to that. Because if I did, I would have done everything I could to stop it. I think it was a perfect storm. Whether it was the COVID-19 response, whether it was the opioid epidemic, a breakdown of our mental health system, whether it's the Martin v. Boise case and you put all those together and you compound them and it's created this.
ES: Do you think Phoenix police response to that area has added to how conditions are currently down there?
BF: I think if without the Phoenix police being down there, the conditions would be a lot worse.
ES: Has there ever been orders to stand down or not enforce things in "The Zone"?
BF: It hasn't been ordered directly from myself or above me now. Has there been an interpretation of court rulings or judge's orders that have directed us not to enforce specific codes? Yes.
ES: And how difficult does that make your job?
BF: The difficult part? It makes it difficult as it relates to those specific codes and not being able to utilize those codes.
ES: What do you make of the frustration that property owners, neighbors, people who live in that area who have come forth and said publicly that they've been feeling for years?
BF: Yeah, I get it. I feel for them. Like I said, I've worked on there. I know them all. I've worked around them. I've worked with them. I know them. I understand their issues. I understand their concerns and understand the plight and what they're dealing with. And I get it.
ES: Have You Ever Have or Have you ever had officers attacked while they're down there?
BF: We've had officers assaulted Yes.
ES: Are officers who work in that area paid more? Is there more of a hazard? Are they treated any differently?
BF: No.
ES: Do you have officers that sign up to do this? Or are they assigned to this area?
BF: So officers do test to become members of the Downtown Operations Unit. And knowing that when coming to the downtown Operations Unit, they are going to be working in the area around the campus. What was interesting is we recently did a rebuild of officers within the downtown operations unit where we had some senior officers that had the opportunity to go to other positions within the Downtown Operations Unit. They chose to stay there. They chose to stay in the area around the campus and continue the work they're doing.
ES: Why do you think that is?
BF: As difficult as the job is and as difficult as being an officer in the area around the campus, there's also a sense of - there are times where it's very fulfilling. And when everything works out the way it's supposed to work out. It's a very fulfilling position.
ES: Do you have a sense of how much overtime has been spent on "The Zone?"
BF: We brought in officers for crime suppression reasons. And we did utilize some overtime for that. And I'm talking about the crime suppression project. There are times other times where we can't have one officer, a single officer working in that area. So, we will bring an extra officer if somebody takes a day off to to make sure ensure that we have two officers that are working in there. And that's a commitment we've made to the business owners and we'd made to the campus and so we do spend overtime in those areas. I don't have an exact number.
ES: We've been able to see new records in court from January to May 2022, compared to the same time frame in 2023, there was a reduction in property crimes overall and violent crimes overall. But if you look at the numbers, you see that assaults were up. Is this misleading to say crime is down?
BF: I don't think so. With those specific crimes, that's the unified crime report. Those numbers are numbers we use everywhere across the nation when determining whether violent crime is up or property crime goes up or down. Experts decide whether those are true numbers or not. And so I don't think it's misleading at all. I would also say is a lot of the violent crime we have made arrests in the vast majority of the aggravated assaults, the robberies and the homicides. And you just you're working in an area where you have a lot of individuals that have the potential to committed a crime like that.
ES: For every arrest you make, there's always someone else ready to commit another crime?
BF: Yes.
ES: What have police been doing to maybe respond differently or address the mental illness and the drug use?
BF: Trying to identify those that are bringing the drugs into the area. That's not in any way going to solve the substance use disorder. But if we can prevent individuals from bringing the drugs into the neighborhood and preying on those individuals, I think that's one of the keys that we focus on. And we utilize different techniques from that. Introducing technology, like we talked about cameras and other technology that we've introduced into that neighborhood to help us address some of that criminal activity. Those are different things that we've been doing. In the past, we haven't had or haven't been able to do or bring that into it. The Phoenix Police Department as a whole has really been increasing his technology as we've gone down in staffing and we tried to supplement that staffing through other alternatives. We've done it through civilian hiring and technology. So we've added a lot of technology into the police department and we've been utilizing that in the area around the campus.
ES: You've detailed a lot of recent arrests. Are you tracking to ensure these are prosecuted that people are maybe going to court or going wherever they need to go to get them out of that Zone environment?
BF: Yeah, we do. We do follow through and make sure that there is prosecution on it. And if there's not prosecution, which does happen, we follow up and make sure if there's any issues or concerns that we we address that and we correct, so it doesn't happen again.
ES: What are the biggest wins you've seen in that area over the past few months?
BF: What the Office of Homeless Solutions is doing with taking back block by block definitely made a difference. I can tell you firsthand for being down there myself, for seeing the numbers that are on a weekly count that I see that in that area of "The Zone," those numbers have gone down since they started their encampment cleanups.
Again, I can totally understand a business owner has somebody that just relocated from a place that we we did do a cleanup and now has a tent where he didn't have a tent before, he's gonna say it got worse. I totally understand that and see how they would say that. But for the entire zone that we're talking about, n the area on the campus, those numbers have gone down.
ES: The city says they're anticipating it'll be about nine months for them to continue that process of going block by block. Is that too long?
BF: Yeah, I mean, nine months is a long time, but we have to understand the resources. We have to understand that there needs to be adequate shelter available for the for the Office of Homeless Solutions, for the Human Services Campus. We don't just build shelters overnight. And I totally understand that. That whole timeframe is based off of how much shelter they can provide in a short period of time.
ES: Will having the structured campground that's in the works now help police operations?
BF: I believe it will, yes.
ES: What will it take to ultimately restore a sense of safety in that neighborhood?
BF: As we go through this process and we do clean up a block by block, I truly believe that that's, that's going to have an impact. The sense of safety and the perception of safety? Do I believe that that area in the campus is going to be crime free? Absolutely not. I don't think we've been able to do it anywhere in the city. There's always gonna be that potential, but I do believe we can have a drastic impact on it.
The Zone
12News offers the latest updates on one of the largest homeless encampments in Maricopa County.